Technology, Support, and News Forum

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

OK, I made a topic for this probably like a year ago and figured I'd just live with it. But now, I'm really confused and don't know if anyone has any new information. Basically, my desktop has a power issue. It doesn't like starting up cold unless I turn off the PSU for ~10 seconds, flip it on, wait ~10 seconds, then hit the power button. Also, when it's in the super low power standby (where fans and all turn off) it will stay like that for a random amount of time before it just dies. Initially I figured it was the PSU, tried another one and it didn't change anything. Then, a friend I built a computer for had the same motherboard with the same problem, so I figured it was a motherboard issue. I never tried anything until now, but I just replaced the Epox motherboad for a space Foxconn I had laying around and guess what? Same issue! So now I'm really confused, as since this started happening I've changed the case, psu, motherboard, processor, video card, and memory, yet this still persists. I don't remember if the second PSU I tried was brand new or not, but the one I have right now is an Antec TruePower and the other one I tried it with was a modular Antec (maybe a neopower?). So this is common between 2 computers where initially the only thing in common was the motherboard, but now that's been eliminated as a possibility and I'm so confused. And now that I'm paying for electricity it'd be really nice to be able to use the low power standby.

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

Alright, just did some more testing. Essentially, I connected the power supply to to the board with just a cpu and stick of ram. No video card, heatsink, or anything. When I turn it on such that it works (or at least as far as it can go with no video card, hard drives, etc) there are 3 LEDs on the mobo that come on: CPU, DIMM, and CHIP. Then if I kill power and try to start it up a second time without power-cycling the CPU, the DIMM LED comes on only. I mean, given that this is a super stripped down test, is the only option the power supply and I just tested it with another PSU that seemed to be good but really wasn't?

The only other thing I can think of is that my memory requires high voltage... I want to say 2.6-2.7 volts... Now, this has been the case since I built the computer and these problems didn't start till later in its life, but could it be that somehow the PSU just can't supply enough voltage to the right place?

[mnemonicj Profile]

Wow! That is the highest voltage I have heard RAM require unless it is overclocked. The standard voltages I know of are 1.5V, 1.8V, and 2.1V. Is your motherboard compatible with RAM that operates at that voltage? Check the specs on your motherboard, because it may require some adjustments to provide the RAM with that much voltage.

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

Well, I really don't think those are the standard voltages. Checking this page, 2.5-2.6 seems to be the standard. I know with the epox board I've been able to give it 2.97v when I was trying to overclock it just fine (apparently these g.skill sticks love them some volts). So it really doesn't seem like that should be the issue.

Guess I forgot to mention it was DDR400, as it does use more voltage than DDR2/3

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

Well, I realize there's not much activity around here but I figured I'd post back with something I stumbled upon so it might be useful information for someone. I just fired up Everest and noticed that my 5v standby rail is fluctuating between 4.41 and 4.6v, which I'm pretty sure is below spec. To me, this would indicate that it's the PSU, I just don't have a fresh one to test.

On that note, anyone know a possible cheap fix to get the voltage back to where it should be? It's an Antec TruePower 550w. It's 5 years old, and I used to run it 24/7 so I can half understand how it could just be showing its age. Anything I can replace on the inside? Bad caps?

[Nativedude Profile WebsiteICQ]

Well I'm sure if ya had a schematic and poked around with a meter long enough you probably could find the problem
But that's not always the safest option, let alone when you find the problem it might not even be able to be replaced

From what I just read, anything above 4.5 is acceptable, issues start occurring once it drops below that

I'd say it's not really worth the aggravation, get ya a new one maybe a different brand
Even if ya did replace something on the inside, I'd hate for it to short out and blow your motherboard all to heck and back

[mnemonicj Profile]

Yeah, I would recommend replacing it too. The power supply is one of the cheaper things to replace that, if bad, can cause the greatest deal of damage. Think of it this way, replace the bad power supply now, or replace a motherboard and a power supply later.

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

Any chance I could tell my motherboard to use a different rail for power or use another voltage line? The cold boots are one thing, but I also read that the standby power was given to the USB stuff, and when I boot up often my mouse and/or keyboard won't work and I have to unplug it and plug it back in before it responds. I don't want to blow up my motherboard but this is an old computer and not really worth spending much more money on. It's bottlenecking as it is, I just gave it a 25% overclock to be able to play Bad Company 2 with all low settings lol

[JabbaPapa Profile]

Any chance I could tell my motherboard to use a different rail for power or use another voltage line? The cold boots are one thing, but I also read that the standby power was given to the USB stuff, and when I boot up often my mouse and/or keyboard won't work and I have to unplug it and plug it back in before it responds. I don't want to blow up my motherboard but this is an old computer and not really worth spending much more money on. It's bottlenecking as it is, I just gave it a 25% overclock to be able to play Bad Company 2 with all low settings lol

It does sound like a bad PSU on the face of things, although I have to say that a bad BIOS can create exactly the same issues, and so can mobo/CPU intercompatibility problems, as well as electrical damage to the motherboard or to the whole of the computer. I have had a somewhat similar migratory hardware problem, and my final conclusions following some rather lengthy testing and hardware replacement on my machine was that some sort of electrical damage had been distributed towards several components of the original machine, so that all of them could fail with similar circumstances instead of a single faulty component (apart from the PSU itself) being the single cause of the problems I was encountering. I do not know what the actual, original source of the damage was in my own case, but it's well known that lightning damage can provide some *extremely* strange behaviour in a system which can appear to still be properly functional.

Your descriptions of USB failure may be indicative of your motherboard starting to fail, USB is often the first thing that starts failing in such cases, although electrical failure of the PSU can provide the same symptoms of course.

You can of course keep the machine running for as long as it's still got some life in it, but I would agree that a machine of that generation would only be worth extra expenditure should it basically still be working properly, and I really think that you should start looking at a more extensive hardware upgrade : mobo, CPU, RAM, PSU --- particularly given your description of the system bottlenecking even when it does work, due of the extra demands of your gaming today as compared to when the rig was new.

[ar1stotle Profile ICQYIM]

Yea, the weird thing is that at one point, I know I tried another PSU on it when it first started having these issues, and it didn't work so I figured it was just the motherboard. Well, I replaced the motherboard with a Foxconn that wasn't new but should have worked and it did the exact same things. So yea, my only thought with the PSU is maybe I just have so much stuff in my case that the load is more than the PSUs I've been trying are used to handling? I dunno, maybe I'll just make some money over the summer and build a new one after I graduate or something lol. As much as I'd like to take my earnings and build an awesome rig I know I don't really have the time to game that I used to anyway.